Notre Dame is a well coached, very average football team. Their defense can’t stop anybody and their passing offense appears to consist of just throwing the ball up high so someone ugly can catch it. They played pretty well against USC, but they haven’t beaten a single good team, lost to a bad Michigan State team, and struggled in several of their wins including tonight against Stanford.
Can’t really blame the BCS, pretty much every single computer poll ranks them in the #12 – #14 range (and one #17.) Somehow the human voters keep voting them ahead of better teams with more impressive resumes. Ohio State or Oregon is going to get screwed out of a BCS bowl bid.
Think they’ll be attacked in the media like the Horns were after yesterday’s not nearly as close Aggie game? Nope, they’re already being praised for their “heart” and “character.” And now ESPN brought up how Cal got shafted last year by Texas. Yikes.
reply to #1
Matt
November 27th, 2005 at 1:30 pm
I don’t really have anything against Notre Dame, but I definitely found myself hoping they lost yesterday’s game. I don’t see how anyone can make the arguement that they should get to go to a BCS bowl over Oregon or Ohio State.
reply to #2
Brian
November 27th, 2005 at 2:30 pm
Lou Holtz said “Notre Dame desstherved the BCS bid becauthe they’re Notre Dame.” Mark May thought (correctly) that he was an idiot.
reply to #3
Patrick Short
November 28th, 2005 at 9:25 am
You just defended Mark May….. so your ability to call anyone an idiot, especially someone who has won a national championship, has no relevance what-so-ever. Mark May must be one of the stupidest commentators in the history of the game; his predictions for the season rank somewhere alongside “Dewey Defeats Truman.”
reply to #4
Brian
November 28th, 2005 at 9:52 am
Lou Holtz, at least half the time, is an idiot and a cheater. The other half the time you can’t understand him. I think he’d probably be a pretty good analyst if he’d calm down once in a while and if he’d realize it wasn’t 1989.
Mark May is okay, he’s at least more moderate in his wrong opinions and doesn’t act like a complete lunatic or go off the deep end.
It’s certainly a bad sign when I’m longing for Trev Alberts and John Mackovic.
reply to #5
Jack
November 28th, 2005 at 12:12 pm
Name ONE Notre Dame WIN (besides Stanford) that they struggled in. ND beat Michigan and Stanford by 7 and beat EVERY OTHER OPPENENT by at least 19 points in their other 7 wins. That isn’t close and that isn’t struggling in “sever other of their wins” my friend.
reply to #6
Brian
November 28th, 2005 at 12:28 pm
Jack… I consider being close at halftime with Syracuse, BYU, and Washington all pretty bad, and that’s several of their wins. If you’re going to play mediocre competition you better dominate them and the Irish didn’t really do that a single time this year.
reply to #7
Matt
November 28th, 2005 at 12:42 pm
Jack, you don’t actually think Notre Dame deserves to go to a BCS game ahead of both Ohio State and Oregon do you?
reply to #8
Rod
November 28th, 2005 at 12:55 pm
Brian,
I think your analsys of the of Syracuse, BYU, Washington and Stanford games are acurate. But could you please comment on the game against No. 1 ranked USC.
reply to #9
Brian
November 28th, 2005 at 1:02 pm
Notre Dame lost to USC. Does Fresno State deserve to go to a BCS game? How bout Arizona State?
ND matches up real well with USC because their strength (passing) exploits the Trojans’ biggest weakness (their secondary.) They still didn’t win the game, at home.
Since when did we start giving so much credit for moral victories?
reply to #10
Daniel C.
November 28th, 2005 at 3:53 pm
We need to start with the facts, Notre Dame had the highest difficulty of schedule ranking in the country this year so we can drop the “they didn’t play anybody this year” crap. All you have to do is look at the numbers…. Brady Quins numbers are all better than that guy from USC are. To attack the passing game would just be foolish. And I can’t believe UT fans would dare say if your not dominating at the half your mediocre. Two words for you Oklahoma State. You we losing at half. Last but not least ,check the footage yourself, it is available online, Reggie Bush pushed Linert over the goal line to win, NOT LEGAL in collage football! Please keep in mind all of this is fact. I’m not saying ND is God or anything like that but give credit where credit is due, ecspecially when both UT and USC are in two of the weakest confrences in the country.
reply to #11
Brian
November 28th, 2005 at 4:15 pm
Daniel, your comment couldn’t be more off on almost all points…
Your “facts” couldn’t be more wrong. Depending on which poll you look at, Notre Dame’s schedule is mediocre at best. It’s weaker than USC and Texas’ in most of them, hence why many of the computer polls have the Irish so low. Look at the Colley Matrix ratings: Texas has 4 top 25 wins and 6 top 50 wins while USC has 2 top 25 and 6 top 50. Notre Dame? A single top 25 victory and remarkably only two wins over top 50 teams.
I said Notre Dame’s passing game was a strength, I certainly didn’t attack it.
So Texas didn’t dominate 2 quarters at Okie State and played below themselves Friday versus the Aggies, Notre Dame didn’t dominate a single one of their opponents this season.
So what credit is Notre Dame “due”? They haven’t beaten a decent team this season, they played a weak schedule, lost to a bad Michigan State team at home, and have an average defense.
reply to #12
Matt
November 28th, 2005 at 4:24 pm
“UT and USC are in two of the weakest confrences in the country” – Easy to say when Notre Dame is too scared to join the Big 10.
You seem to omit some facts in your arguement. Oregon’s only loss is to #1 USC. Ohio State’s only losses are to #2 Texas and #3 Penn State. Notre Dame’s losses are to #1 USC and 5-6 Michigan State (at home!). I think there is a pretty big gap there.
reply to #13
Daniel C.
November 28th, 2005 at 8:15 pm
Big Gap? When did one game become a big gap? And the biggest of the two games was one of the best collage games ever played, and ND is the only team to truly test USC, who is no doubt a great team. I’m not saying USC is not good, they are awesome and I’ll bet anyone, anything, if you ask USC which team they would not want to play again this season its ND. That is the credit thats due.
Brian, I’m not too proud to admit that I was wrong about the ranking. But look at NDs schedule, Michigan was top ten when we played them and there is no reason other than poor D for the Michigan St loss, but keep in mind that was the first time in history that ND scored 40 points and lost. Michigan St played hard and deserved the win. This is the first year in my life I can remember Tenn not being good, and if I’m not mistaking” And I’m sure if I am you will tell me” Tenn was top 15 or better when the season started, add Pitt “ranked” USC and Navy was ranked when we played them. That is not a schedule to sneer at. And to Matt with the “too scared to join the Big 10” comment I think there are other reasons for not joining a confrence, about 14.5 reason to be exact.
reply to #14
Brian
November 28th, 2005 at 10:18 pm
Daniel, your arguments must be pretty weak when the best you’ve got is that you lost in a really entertaining game and people thought the teams you played were good before they lost 7 games.
reply to #15
Matt
November 29th, 2005 at 9:41 am
“ND is the only team to truly test USC” – Fresno State sure tested them and that was at USC.
Face it, there is no legitimate arguement that Notre Dame should go ahead of Ohio State and Oregon other than they will get more ratings. Simple as that.
reply to #16
Daniel C.
November 29th, 2005 at 4:51 pm
Ok, we understand NDs schedule is not KILLER, i got it! My point is, look at UTs and its even worse
Lou Laf Joke
Ohio St. Good
Rice Joke
Missouri Joke
Oklahoma Was Good / Not anymore
Colorado Please
Texas T Pretty good
Ok St Do I need to keep going
Baylor Kansas and Texas AM
Where is that diff level you spoke of, only two are still ranked. At least Tenn, Michigan, Michigan St, Pitt and Purdue have a history of, at least being tough, thats not to mention USC. 80% of UTs teams have never been good. And the said thing is now you get to play Colorado in the con title?! Dont get me wrong I hope UT kills USC and I think they will win. But before you judge ND look at your own.
And yes Fresno St. is tough but that was nowhere near as close as ND and I dont hear anyone on ESPN saying Fresno St should have won. If Reggie Bush didn’t push Linert over the goal line we would not be here waisting our time here with each other. Gentlemen, let me just say this, the BCS is not fair, w/o a playoff it never will be. So lets just hope that someone out there with power fells the same way and will do something about it. But for now I’m glad it finally went NDs way, chaulk it up to the luck of tyhe irish. Good Day and good luck against USC! Hookem Horns!!
reply to #17
Brian
November 29th, 2005 at 5:49 pm
“80% of UTs teams have never been good.”
You do realize Texas is 4th all time in wins don’t you? And gaining? We could/should pass Nebraska next year if they continue to struggle.
And Texas Tech, Colorado, Mizzou, and OU are as good or better than anyone on ND’s schedule not including USC and maybe Michigan. Ohio State is as better than everyone you’ve played (again, sans-USC.)
And most importantly of all…
We won all those games!
reply to #18
Daniel C.
November 29th, 2005 at 7:12 pm
I did not and never would say Texas is not good. They are awsome. I was talking about their opponents. 80% of the opponents UT played this year dont have the tradition of being powerhouse collage football programs like Michigan or Tenn. Of course I’m not refering to Ohio. And I agree with you that apart from USC, Ohio St is better than the other teams we have played this year, I have not said otherwise. Please understand I am not attacking UT only a fool would do that. They deserve to be where they are, and I’m gratefull they are not on NDs schedule.
NOTRE DAME……DEEPLY LOVED, OFTEN HATED, NEVER IGNORED!
reply to #19
matt b
November 29th, 2005 at 7:38 pm
Oh my goodness…
This will teach you brother for messing with the Golden Domers. I am waiting for Regis to make a comment. Rule of thumb, it does not matter where you start out in the rankings, it is where you finish.
Notre Dame, Deeply overated, often hated and unfortunately hard to ignore. Just kidding Daniel, always fun to pick on the rabid fan!
GO TLU Bulldogs, yeah we were D-3 baby! Oh wait, we suck.
reply to #20
duckman
December 3rd, 2005 at 5:45 am
If one was to be extremely objective and give ND the befit of the doubt by saying they played as tough as tough a schedule as Oregon then the fact would remain that ND lost 2 games and Oregon only lost 1. The only justification for ND being picked is making money. The BCS has sold out the foundation for which the BIG bowl games were started fore just to make a buck.
ND hasten won a bowl game in 12 years!! ND has only won 6 bowl games in 25 years!! Anyone se a pattern. The BCS dose not care if ND loses so long as people watch and with ND, they know people will. Hear is a prediction for every one- ND will go to a bowl that they did not deserve and gets blown out.
reply to #21
Ammopapa
December 4th, 2005 at 1:06 am
It may have looked like Notre Dame was struggling against Stanford but look at it this way. Teams get up for Notre Dame, it’s a given… and when a 5-5 team is playing their last game at their stadium and needs a win to become bowl eligble, you would expect a team to play with a little more emotion and keep it close.
reply to #22
Brian
December 4th, 2005 at 10:07 am
You don’t think teams get up to play Texas, USC, Ohio State, Penn State? That’s a stupid argument.
reply to #23
Steve
December 4th, 2005 at 5:08 pm
Just ask USC the only non-tyrone willingham led common opponent between Oregon and Notre Dame, who they would rather play again, oregon (destroyed 45-13 at oregon) or notre dame (were down to their last play and needed a last second score and push to win 34-31). Ohio State is the best 2 loss team followed by auburn and then notre dame, with oregon behind all three of them. Also, to say the BCS computers have notre dame ranked where they should be (10 after the last one) is wrong because the computers do not account for margin of victory. Some computers, when adding in margin of victory/loss have the irish as high as 4
reply to #24
Brian
December 4th, 2005 at 5:24 pm
Good argument (and I agree with your ordering of the 2 loss teams), but when you play an approximately equal schedule like ND and Oregon have you have to look an wins and losses. The Irish lost to a bad Michigan State team at home and Oregon didn’t. You can start comparing margins of victory and “good” losses when you rank teams with equal records.
And nice try on your random removal of Stanford and Washington from the common opponent equation…
reply to #25
duckman
December 4th, 2005 at 6:11 pm
Ignorance is bliss, isn’t it ND fans.
reply to #26
mike
December 14th, 2005 at 12:54 pm
You all need to take:
1) English grammar lessons;
2) Spelling lessons;
3) Typing lessons;
or all three.
Oregon is a piece of duck sh^t. They lost, at home, to USC by 32 points. Their uniforms are hideous (that outght to be enough to disqualify them from all post-season play).
Someone mentioned that Oregon played Washington and Stanford “tougher” than Notre Dame did. But was Oregon playing against their former coach, on the road – after travelling across two time zones? Did Oregon travel across three time zones on Thanksgiving weekend to play Stanford in their LAST HOME GAME EVER IN THE STADIUM? I didn’t think so.
You also point out that ND lost against a bad MSU team, but Oregon didn’t. What was the score of the Oregon-MSU game? Oh wait, they didn’t play. You talk about a bad argument.
Oregon this year is Cal last year. You will bitch and moan that you deserved a BCS bid, then go lose in the Insignificant Bowl, proving everyone else correct.
Unfortunately, Oregon got “snubbed,” otherwise ND would crush them in the Fiesta (Oklahoma gets the opportunity to do it, instead).
“Ducks” rhymes with “sucks” for a reason.
reply to #27
Brian
December 14th, 2005 at 1:45 pm
Mike… Although I do agree Oregon is this year’s Cal, I think you just made the most pathetic argument I’ve ever heard.
“We had to travel far.”
“Oh yeah, well you didn’t play the crappy team we lost to!!”
It’s sad that once mighty Notre Dame has fallen that far.
reply to #28
Duckman
December 14th, 2005 at 3:27 pm
BOOHOO we had to travel far. BOOHOO. Cry me a river. What are you going to say when ND gets blown out and Oregon wins? That post smells alot like another ND fan named IrishJT. He also knows his argument is weak so he attacks the way peaple wright and spell. it is pretty pathetic.
reply to #29
Brian
December 14th, 2005 at 3:32 pm
Duckman, it’s “write and spell.” 🙂
reply to #30
Andrew
December 19th, 2005 at 10:22 pm
Notre Dame Rules !!!!!!!
reply to #31
Andrew
December 19th, 2005 at 10:23 pm
GO IRISH !!!!!
reply to #32
Duke
December 22nd, 2005 at 7:39 pm
Notre Dame is very well coached, and that says alot for football. southern oregon Go Notre Dame!!!!!!!
reply to #33
jack
December 23rd, 2005 at 5:34 pm
DON’T WORRY DUCKS…….. THE BUCKS WILL TAKE CARE OF BIDNESS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
reply to #34
Dugman
December 28th, 2005 at 10:43 am
People wern’t talking ND Football in the beginning.Ranked 44th not much to talk about . let’s get one thing clear for all you Markie May What-a-Be’s. 6 ranked teams at the start, 3 in the top 5.Irish beat all of them except USC , and i dont care what you think of the IRISH , but if you love college football , then that had to be one of the best games that was ever played againt such a dynamic team in over 2 years .and the last time i checked the Overrated Irish did it, Texas is last years Sooner. and Oregon well it’s Oregon, Fiesta Bowl is the bowl to watch , and yes i can smell the Roses , but who cares.Blow-out on the way ,better “DUCK”.
reply to #35
Brian
December 28th, 2005 at 11:00 am
Dugman, you’ve got to be freaking kidding…
“6 ranked teams at the start, 3 in the top 5.”
That argument is beyond sad, relying on preseason rankings and a “good loss” is an act of desperation and/or delusion. Notre Dame only beat two teams with freaking winning records all year, one of those being a Michigan team without their starting RB for 3 quarters.
reply to #36
Dugman
December 28th, 2005 at 12:20 pm
Sad enough to get a typical B.S. response from you! Preseason must mean something to someone , doesnt to me. What i do know is USC & Pronghorns have’nt moved from there spots sense then.Mich was 3rd in the nation till they lost and went to 12th, guess that does make ND look weak.lost to a 1# team and the Irish didnt move one spot. Explain the ‘Just a Good Game Theory” to me again.College ball is unrefined and has many holes in it . The Nation needs to relize that a play-off is needed.ND has just been ND. but lets face it, you get the talent you win games.ND will be a force to reckon with next year and years to come.so spew all your satistacle B.S out you lips and come to an understanding that you either hate the Irish or you love them , no in-between. I think the Mark May Bus is Leaving for Ohio BUCK-OOOO
reply to #37
Dugman
December 28th, 2005 at 1:20 pm
Brian dont take it to heart , on what i say, just giving you sh!&. people think there team always deserve a shot. what it boils down to ,is i dont want to see Ducks play.and nobody else unless you live in that depressing state. just like Flr St. who cares, they dont belong there, but May thinks they do (IDIOT), but doesnt ever give ND any credit for anything, and would rather see Ducks, in his mind Rutgers have a better chance to win a Champ. then the irish. i think he is still upset that the irish didn’t recruit him. Go Skins
reply to #38
Brian
December 28th, 2005 at 2:30 pm
Doug, I’m actually a Texas fan I just think ND is overrated. I definitely agree though that I’d rather see Ohio State vs. ND than Ohio State vs. Oregon.
reply to #39
Dugman
December 28th, 2005 at 4:55 pm
The Truth is heard. I knew you were a Pronghorn.HAHA. To bad one player is not going to work vs USC. I feel for ya. To bad Young didnt win the Heisman – think we both know Quinn has that wrapped up next year.You want to talk overrated. One thing is true 1st u must be underated ( as the Irish usually are ) before you can be overated. take it any day of the week. USC 41 Texas 17 .
reply to #40
sally
November 25th, 2006 at 11:40 am
brian:just because u guys one the national championship last year doesnet mean anything we played the number one team in the nation and they didnt loose any one imporant but u tex fan u lost your whoe team and u guys will have no chance of getting back there to the national championship so go round up some cattle and leave the football playen to good teams